Giveth Governance Meeting #43
Sept 20th, 2018
Youtube Livestream - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0HJ8JKS3-0
Griff, Vojtech, Yalor, Bowen, Linds, Lorelei, Kris
dropped-in: Dani, Lanski, Adam left-early: Yalor
XXX - intentions, expectations, distractions
- Announcement from Lorelei
- RSK Funding
- 5 minutes with Kris
Onboarding process, Unicorn DAC, and roles meeting are all moving fwd so if you have not yet, go into the roles sheet and flesh out the details of your roles/add any that are missing!
We have received a proposal from RSK
We reassess relationship between DApp team and Giveth, we are not working that actively on Giveth, we will focus on deploying the whole platform to RSK, while fixing bugs in Giveth DApp but not adding new features for the next 2 months.
Q: Since you are moving to a new platform - is the idea that giveth is still supposed to use the platform on rsk?
A: No there will be 2 versions of the DApp, people can use either, the DApp was always meant to be blockchain agnostic.
Q: Still using giveth name under RSK?
A: likely not. have our own website with a set of advisors, giveth would be one of them
Q: You are maintaining DApp campaign still?
A: Mostly yes Q: What does maintaining the DApp campaign mean? A: If there is a feature request, it could be paid for thru giveth DApp campaign. They could also be funded from RSK side, but they will end up in the same code base and be available for everybody. Q: Who all is coming with you? A: Whole team: RJ, Satya, Dani, Vojtech Q: If Dani is coming with you, will she continue with the projects she has already been working with onboarding to Giveth? Will she continue with us?
A: This is a difficult Q that I need to have a convo with Dani about. Focus will be on the RSK side since its more social impact side... There hasn't really been any system so far of onboarding new projects so it will mostly be on you guys.
Dani: Happy to hear this convo, came in late. Would love to hear how people feel about the questions ppl raised. I feel quite passionate about giveth. Need more clarification and communication
Yalor: i think multiple deployments is a good idea, think for dani's position it would be hard to do both at the same time.
Griff: I think ppl can play both sides. Like with Unicorn DAC giving the ability to direct giveth trajectory, only getting paid 150 themselves but 450 to delegate to others, it makes it easy to do multiple gigs and have a hand in both projects.
Vojtech: Want to detail longer plan: We expect there will be several deployments of the DApp in different blockchains, keep them under one label. Ethereum.giveth.io and rsk.giveth.io for example . There will be one overarching from the UI perspective.
Kris: I think if we don't have Dani (or a similar onboarder), all the questions/support will fall on me. Let's not split up everything and reinvent the wheel. What can we keep together and continue working on as a team?
Griff: in the end we're maintaining one codebase, we'll all have the same issues in the end. Right now we'll have a ramp up for DevCon and LaBitConf, those will feed into each other. The plan is to bridge RSK to Rinkeby, right? Decision time for how we separate won't really be until January, Feb, March
Yalor: is this funding for giveth on rsk or a new thing?
V: It's funding for a new version of the DApp, its funding for this team also to be working on RSK infrastructure. It will diverge in March and then there's still a month or two
Kris: So i'm hearing theres a possiblity it will not be compatible with ethereum anymore?
V: Yes it will likely happen. It will at some point be taken out of the codebase and be a native deployment. At some point giveth will need a person for that divergence. We have that discussion later in December/January.
Kris: So RJ is going to RSK? That's not what it looked like before.
V: Not 100% confirmation, but it looks that way.
Kris: will we know about this before it happens?
V: yes, right now it's something that hasn't been discussed at all. RSK has clear deadline for deployment (which is beginning of Nov) so they can use it for payments for LaBitConf. The idea is all the projects on the humanitarian day in that event will receive payments thru the DApp.
Yalor: they could just say this is a new thing they are building? and not mention giveth at all?
V: its a possibility yes
G: Is there no interest in maintaining one UI for both these groups?
V: RSK's interest is to have a native deployment. So in the end, it can't be one platform. Unless we want to move Giveth to RSK.
G: Why not bridge Eth to RSK? Bridging is something we do all the time it doesn't seem like a bad idea. Giveth strongly values being blockchain agnostic. Maybe brdiging to RSK would make sense.
V: yeah theres no strong feelings against this
G: What about the humanitarian white label? COuld we get social coding on this etc?
V: not going to say yes right now, shoulnd't even be curated in the end. Question is will it fit the overall goal? I don't see a problem with that
Lanski: Easiest thing for the giver AND the maker is to be able to donate with whatever coin they want. Wouldn't graceful end goal be that you would be able to donate RSK or Eth or BTC thru the same UI?
V: Yes. For the recipient side this could be challenging.
G: This is a feature we would absolutely be excited about. Is it an option to have both features on both platforms?
V: All options yes, not something we are talking about in the next few months
G: so in the short term, it would be technically difficult to integrate both?
V: yeah there are higher priority things rn
Kris: you keep mentioning white label product. What does that mean? What will it be called?
V: the development will be white labeled but individual deployments will not. Onboarding at LaBitConf would be called Blockchain For Humanity.
Lanski: when we do white labeled products in my IT company, we let them have their own name but on the side, a small "Powered by Giveth" for example. Is this a possiblity?
Vojtech: for sure.
Dani: continuing to acknowledge Giveth is a consideration
V: this comes from the license we are using, GPL3, which says any previous contributors need to be acknowledged. At least the repositories will always say this was originally developed under giveth brand.
Lorelei: how much are you still a part of giveth? who is funding your work on bugs? will you be in meetings?
V: always a part of community, will work on bugs no expectations of who will pay me, we need clarification on this
G: there is still money in the DApp campaign, another 8k coming from aragon etc. If RSK throws down 25k, it takes less of a pull from Giveth.
Yalor: you can be a part of Giveth without getting paid by Giveth
Griff: To clarify with the Aragon Nest Grant, there was confusion with what an "Aragon App" is we were talking about turning the Smart Contracts into an Aragon App and then connecting it to our UI, they misread that and thought we were building out their UI and using it for giveth. I think we will end up getting 16k for creating the aragon DAC but then the rest gets put on hold... i mean unless we find someone that wants to do it... but the easiest thing is to let the Aragon DAC make that happen.
Kris: What is this 16k? The nest grant is on hold?
G: We had some poor comms with Aragon they wanted liquid pledging to be the focus and were disappointed by other milestones about onboarding etc
Kris: we're now getting donated 16k by aragon - this is really nice! is this something that RSK would be interested in donating to the Giveth DAC since they will benefit and have been benefitting from it?
V: this q has not been raised, they are just very excited about developing the platform. They heard we were running out of money and came to save it. The idea was to not stop developing the platform and just continue with social impact. We can ask them if they would like to give to Giveth DAC. They could have taken the code and run with it, and they didn't. (Good luck with doing that on their own) ...So no expectation of pay from them.
G: There def are feature requests like for Reward DAO and Unicorn DAC. These will likely be bounties from giveth, how will you manage these?
V: These can just be issues on github, where what will be developed is defined, we can estimate how much money that will cost, and then we can dev it or anyone else can.
G: well you have merge rights so there is something there, you will be maintaining the code base. Can you talk thru that process more?
V: There's a 3 step process: 1. feature request 2. approval process 3. funding. That's how it works with every open source project. Maintainers say what it's worth.
Dani: how does the DApp circle continuity flow beyond this? Vojtech will you not be the circle lead and Giveth will need to replace you?
V: idea is that the whole team will move to be independent from Giveth? I'm happy to leave my role if someone else will take it? I def will not play a big role in Giveth anymore. I suspect the rest of the team will follow that example
Dani: So will the DApp circle still continue and we need to replace?
G: best to keep V maintaining it, i don't know about someone else managing the donations.. i wouldn't replace anything. it eases problems from giveth to have someone else throwing 25k at it... V will you continue to dish points for dapp reward dao?
V: long term this does not make sense, this month yes tho.
Lorelei: sounds like G&V have opposing views on how much time V is spending on stewarding Giveth DApp development, how do we reconcile this and how many hours are you planning on spending on Giveth?
V: we will make this like DAppNode. it doesn't have that many committments to giveth
G: in the end both RSK and Giveth are deployments of the white labeled DApp. RSK is paying way more money for the DApp going fwd than we will. So we may become second class citizens for a while and that's ok.
Griff - this is great! all projects in giveth can pick whatever level of involvement with giveth that they want. DApp has always been our flagship product but is diff from giveth galaxy
Dani - really appreciate this opportunity to ask questions and have broad perspective. Thank you
Adam - been listening. I think it's awesome, been a big fan of RSK for a long time.
Lindsay - nice to see open transparency about these convos to move fwd
Bowen - this is exciting big news, originally sounded a lot more ominous than it is. this is moving us towards the chain agnosticism that was the idea in the first place
Kris - I am personally very sad that Vojtech is leaving. I have always appreciated him very much, very valuable opinion in this project and in this meeting. The only constant with Giveth is change and i am embracing it.
Lorelei - keep the family together! Sad but exciting, this is still going towards what we want.
Vojtech - i'm not leaving! it's an evolution of a working relationship. we will all be together at devcon. the idea that i have had personally is this allows me to work more focused on the DApp, but i hope you all feel free to reach out to discuss anything. Many things mentioned here today were how i see it and how i hope this will happen, but the fact is we are at the very beginning of things with RSK and we don't know a lot of things for sure yet!
Lanski - I think this is an extremely valuable learning, not a lesson because this is just what happens, but it is a learning. Here is the purpose. Purpose brings you to take a different path means that the project is ALIVE! We might have diff definitions of what giveth is but we all are working on blockchain for good. I'm really excited about this. I'm really greatful to be a part of this. This looks so mature and i see so many possibilities.
Amend and Clarify
Hope everyone in this meeting will express to those who missed. And hope that I (Griff) can still be a part of the RSK discussions.
Someone selling pixels and donating to us
There is someone, maybe a pyramid scheme, using our name while selling pixels and saying he will donate 80% to us
Ignore it. Don't talk to him.
XXX - Reaction
Amend and Clarify
Also mainly ignore. This is a scam.
XXX - Reaction
Amend and Clarify
End of meeting